Timeline for Must a tritone substitution use a dominant functioning seventh chord?
Current License: CC BY-SA 4.0
10 events
| when toggle format | what | by | license | comment | |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Mar 7, 2019 at 4:27 | comment | added | jdjazz | @TomSerb, ah, I thought you were saying "major 7th chord / minor 7th chord." This is a difference in the way theorists talk in different genres. In jazz, there's no ambiguity about how theorists use the term "dominant 7th chord"--it refers to a chord containing a major 3rd & a minor 7th. Then again, it's much more common in jazz to encounter this in a non-dominant function. | |
| Mar 7, 2019 at 3:55 | comment | added | Tom Serb | @jdjazz - Ben's comment was that what makes it a dominant chord is the fact that it's the V. That's true, because only the 5th scale degree is the dominant; V is the 'dominant chord' no matter what kind of chord it is. Theorists who like to split hairs maintain that ONLY the V can be a "dominant 7th", and a 1-3-5-b7 chord on any other scale degree is a "major/minor seventh" chord (a major triad with an minor 7th interval above the root) | |
| Mar 7, 2019 at 3:09 | comment | added | jdjazz | @TomSerb, I'm not sure I follow your last comment. Dominant 7th chords have the tones 1-3-5-b7. By contrast, a major 7th chord is 1-3-5-7 and a minor 7th is 1-b3-5-b7. A dominant 7th chord doesn't have to have a V function. Besides V7 chords, some other common dominant 7th chords are: II7, IV7, bVII7, and III7 (which is arguably V7/vi). | |
| Mar 6, 2019 at 1:37 | comment | added | Tom Serb | @BenCrowell - you're correct, any chord on the V can properly be called the dominant chord (and if you're going to split hairs, any "dominant" seventh that isn't the V is a major/minor7th chord) | |
| Mar 5, 2019 at 22:11 | comment | added | user9480 | @TomSerb: What makes it a dominant chord is that it has a 3 and b7, but what makes it a seventh chord is not having a 9, 11, or 13. You don't need a 7 to make it a dominant chord. A triad can be a dominant, e.g., a G triad in the key of C. | |
| Mar 5, 2019 at 12:35 | comment | added | Tom Serb | @BenCrowell - What makes it a dominant chord is that it has a 3 and b7, but what makes it a seventh chord is not having a 9, 11, or 13. That's why I distinguished function from "seventh" | |
| Mar 5, 2019 at 8:12 | comment | added | Tim | @BenCrowell - looks like that could become an answer! But with the internal tritone, won't the substitution be a dominant something anyway? What happens on the 5th or 9th won't affect that tritone, which is needed for tts anyway. | |
| Mar 4, 2019 at 20:10 | comment | added | user9480 | But retaining the function (and the internal tritone) does not require the substitution also be a dominant 7th chord. It could be Gb7+, or F#7b9, or any other altered or extended chord with a dominant function and a tritone between its third and seventh. To me, a 7+ or 7b9 is a dominant 7th chord. Additional colors, tensions, or alterations doesn't change the fact that it's a dominant 7th. What makes it a dominant 7th is that it has the 3 and 7 in it. I guess this is just terminology, but the OP's question is a question about terminology. | |
| Mar 4, 2019 at 17:21 | comment | added | Michael Curtis |
Why change the key from the question in your answer examples? Richard gave C, but your answer is for F. It just makes things a little harder to follow IMO.
|
|
| Mar 4, 2019 at 16:27 | history | answered | Tom Serb | CC BY-SA 4.0 |